That *was* the January Window

[Ghost7]

Only people with integrity will walk so that rules out Waggott. End of speculation.

[Mercer]

1 hour ago, 47er said:

What would be the point?

Indeed!

Rovers now focusing their scouting efforts on  Blacksnape and Pleasington.

Edited February 4 by Mercer

[RevidgeBlue]

10 minutes ago, Ghost7 said:

Only people with integrity will walk so that rules out Waggott. End of speculation.

and Broughton seemingly, as I predicted.

But hey - sacrificial lamb slaughtered, nothing to see here, business as normal.

[tomphil]

20 minutes ago, Mercer said:

Indeed!

Rovers now focusing their scouting efforts on  Blacksnape and Pleasington.

Alongside Broughton and JDT with supposed knowledge of the Scandi/Euro market (turned up 1 trump in Trons and one turnip in Leo) didn't they recruit lower lge experience scouts ?

i.e a guy from Oxford ?

[Andy]

Ok, so trying to make some sense of the McGuire situation.

From a few sources, we apparently submitted the local/FA/PFA  transfer forms on time, hence why we were happy to announce the signing - pending international clearance and work permit requirements.

The ITC in this instance would be us completing and returning this form:
https://ussoccer.app.box.com/v/international-transfer-pdf
Which doesn't need to be completed before the UK transfer deadline (just required before he can play for us).

Which leave the work permit situation. I haven't been able to find anything which confirms if this needs approving before the UK transfer deadline, only knowledge of how it works on FM (where you do need it in place prior to the deadline).

All of that said, if there was no issue, surely the club would have put something out - or even paraded the lad during the QPR debacle.

Yes, I was bored, no I've not been drinking and yes, I'm now going to bed.

[Torgeir]

To sell the new model to the owners, they must've promised a lot of return on the player-trading model. Looks obvious to me that India put their foot down on incomings and we could only pay minuscule fees. 

[arbitro]

Reading some posts about who can approve things it's almost like we are a normal club. Well we aren't. A financial commitment of the McGuire kind would have to have Indian approval and history tells us that they simply drag their heels and like to make people wait. If the McGuire deal has stalled then that's three that have gone the same way in a year which is unheard of (I think somebody found one previous case after an internet search). I don't know for sure but I do know Ian Silvester has done dozens of transfers over the years in his time at Leicester, Liverpool, Leeds and Rovers and every other one must have gone through on time and in full compliance. He might be the scapegoat here, the sacrificial lamb to save face and if he does go it will more likely be with an NDA to protect the owners reputation which is all they are bothered about.

The real enemies of this club are the owners.

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Exiled_Rover said:

So a loan-to-buy (with a multi-million £ commitment) has failed to go through twice in twelve months when we've been suffering under financial problems due to the Venky's tax fraud... and you don't think someone at the club is deliberately sabotaging deals?

Ok. 

If I had to guess how this went down - Broughton set up the original transfer for McGuire. It got to Pune and they said "no, you can't spend any of the Wharton money". He then tries to rescue the deal (and get around that stipulation) with a loan-to-buy for the summer and generates the loan fee by selling Ennis. Obviously then someone in India says "no", but it's too late and the deal is already in motion... so they have to sabotage the paperwork AGAIN.

I don't think we paid a loan fee for the French CB or Ayari. We're literally dealing exclusively in freebies and free loans. The Venkys do not know if the Indian government will ever let them put any money in again - that Wharton transfer fee is going to be swallowed up in running costs as we all predicted.

I can believe that we set up these loan to buy deals with little intention to purchase, even if the loans go well. I can believe that we're quickly gaining a reputation of being a waste of time to deal with when it comes to deadline day deals at the death, or loans with an option to buy.

George Hirst was an earlier example of a loan with an option to buy. It was reported that the option to purchase last summer was £5m.

Lewis O'Brien was reportedly an obligation to buy at £10m if we earned promotion. So, although that was an obligation to make the purchase, being promoted would have certainly softened the blow. You can imagine that, somehow, the Board would have tried to wriggle their way out of it.

For Duncan McGuire, I cannot see us spending £6m on him in summer, even if the EFL approve his loan move today.

All of that, I believe.

But your story about a conspiracy to scupper the deals from somebody inside the club just does not stack up. Consider Ethan Brierley, which you've conveniently skipped. The fee was reported to be £80k, and yet we messed up the paperwork for that, too. At the same time, we paid a hefty loan fee for Sorba Thomas. We also made a permanent signing for a fee in Connor O'Riordan. Why wasn't that deal scuppered? Is your angle here that somebody is being instructed, on deadline day, to save the club some money by scuppering paperwork? Do you think Silvester is suddenly in league with somebody? If so, who?

Deadline day, three lots of failed filing of paperwork and, as much as some of you won't want to hear it, Gregg Broughton, are the common denominators of failing to get signings over the line at the death. I simply don't buy that the cause of that is a club gremlin popping it's head up on deadline to scupper the deals. I accept that there have been shady things in the last 13 years, none of which we can prove but only speculate on, but we've had 13 constant years of absolute wasters down at Ewood. It's a culture of incompetence and complacency. That, to me, is the simplest, most glaring, and therefore most likely reason we make schoolboy errors like this on deadline day.

Edited February 5 by goozburger

[wilsdenrover]

10 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

If that’s all Broughton does as you claim then he’s under employed, overpaid, and isn’t actually very good at it. Another case for getting rid of the DoF role and letting a manger do the job

That’s far from what his job entails so I doubt he is under employed.

Whether he is overpaid and/or no good at his job are entirely different ‘arguments’ to make.

 

[wilsdenrover]

9 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

and Broughton seemingly, as I predicted.

But hey - sacrificial lamb slaughtered, nothing to see here, business as normal.

Aren’t sacrificial lambs usually lower in the food chain?

[chaddyrovers]

27 minutes ago, goozburger said:

For Duncan McGuire, I cannot see us spending £6m on him in summer, 

Then it's pointless setting up these deals, our recruitment team doing their scouting and research on players. 

I would buy him. You chased him all January including setting up a permanent transfer deal then change it. You clearly wanted him and was our first choice striker target

[TheRevAshton]

Ian Sylvester is experienced and knows how to close a deal, as proven throughout his career. I am fully in the camp that these cock-ups were planned to save the Club money, given the lingering uncertainty around the funds being approved by the Indian Courts.

Those morons in Pune clearly don't want to commit to paying decent fees for players, even if they prove they're worth it.

Once is a mistake, twice is a choice.

Sylvester will be made the scapegoat i'm sure, but the truth will come out in time.

VENKY'S OUT, WAGGOTT OUT.

Edited February 5 by TheRevAshton

[wilsdenrover]

3 minutes ago, TheRevAshton said:

Ian Sylvester is experienced and knows how to close a deal, as proven throughout his career. I am fully in the camp that these cock-ups were planned to save the Club money, given the lingering uncertainty around the funds being approved by the Indian Courts.

Those morons in Pune clearly don't want to commit to paying decent fees for players, even if they prove they're worth it.

Once is a mistake, twice is a choice.

Sylvester will be made the scapegoat i'm sure, but the truth will come out in time.

VENKY'S OUT, WAGGOTT OUT.

Why set up the deals in the first place though?

I appreciate the ‘to show we tried’ argument but surely there’s easier ways of doing this than fudging the paperwork?

 

[KentExile]

I wonder if the Rovers twitter account will have the balls to tweet a happy birthday message to Duncan McGuire today?

They do seem to be tone deaf sometimes, so I wouldn't bet against it

 

 

 

 

[FE123]

I now believe that this “admin error” was intentional rather than a mistake. Sylvester, Waggott more than experienced enough dealing with international transfers. Never known to happen at any other football club but they expect us to believe they’ve made this mistake 3 times in 12 months. It’s nonsense and quite frankly an insult to the supporters that they expect us to believe it’s been done in error.

 

The only way to deal with this is a clear out from top downwards but it won’t happen. I would expect them to point the finger at GB and the likes of Waggott continue drawing their significant wage from the club while taking 0 responsibility for anything that goes wrong.

 

We have managed to go from one of the best run football clubs around to one of the worst in the world and a laughing stock in the national and international press. I don’t know where we go from here, but I’m looking forward to seeing what spin they put on this over the next 24 hours in blaming anyone else other than themselves.

 

It’s a toxic situation and there is a complete lack of integrity from the owners or the board of this football club. There would be so much more respect if they were to come out and say “We need to sell Adam to afford to continue running this football club and we will not be spending this money on incoming transfers in the near future”

[jim mk2]

41 minutes ago, wilsdenrover said:

That’s far from what his job entails so I doubt he is under employed.

Whether he is overpaid and/or no good at his job are entirely different ‘arguments’ to make.

 

Thanks for clearing that up. My post was conjecture so it’s going to know there are folk on here who have the full facts at their fingertips 

[wilsdenrover]

3 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

Thanks for clearing that up. My post was conjecture so it’s going to know there are folk on here who have the full facts at their fingertips 

I’m only going on what we were told his responsibilities would be when he took the job.

I haven’t a clue how close to the reality that is which is why I put ‘I doubt’ (as against I know).

[JHRover]

People said that Venkys 'rejected' bids for Rothwell and Diaz in a bid to get what they wanted or help the team to promotion. I don't believe they did, I just don't think they approved those sales in sufficient time for them to go ahead.

People said that the O'Brien deal was a transfer paperwork cock up by Broughton, Silvestre, Waggott. I don't believe so, I think authorisation couldn't be obtained from India in time to allow it to complete before the deadline. Looks like the same with McGuire.

People said that the owners had decided to change path from Mowbray which is why they let him go. I don't believe so, I think his contract ran out, they failed to do anything about it until even Mowbray got fed up with them and walked.

It is this silence and complete and utter indifference to the fortunes of their football club that saw Kean wreak havoc for years, that has seen a hollowing out of the club and decaying infrastructure, that saw Mowbray plod on the road to nowhere for 5 years, that sees Waggott sitting in an office he should be nowhere near and still on the gravy train after 6 years.

They are responsible.

[Brainfreeze]

Just now, JHRover said:

People said that Venkys 'rejected' bids for Rothwell and Diaz in a bid to get what they wanted or help the team to promotion. I don't believe they did, I just don't think they approved those sales in sufficient time for them to go ahead.

People said that the O'Brien deal was a transfer paperwork cock up by Broughton, Silvestre, Waggott. I don't believe so, I think authorisation couldn't be obtained from India in time to allow it to complete before the deadline. Looks like the same with McGuire.

People said that the owners had decided to change path from Mowbray which is why they let him go. I don't believe so, I think his contract ran out, they failed to do anything about it until even Mowbray got fed up with them and walked.

It is this silence and complete and utter indifference to the fortunes of their football club that saw Kean wreak havoc for years, that has seen a hollowing out of the club and decaying infrastructure, that saw Mowbray plod on the road to nowhere for 5 years, that sees Waggott sitting in an office he should be nowhere near and still on the gravy train after 6 years.

They are responsible.

This would make perfect sense as to why JDT singled out Waggott, Suhail and the owners. I totally buy this theory. 

[BankEnd Rover]

13 minutes ago, JHRover said:

People said that Venkys 'rejected' bids for Rothwell and Diaz in a bid to get what they wanted or help the team to promotion. I don't believe they did, I just don't think they approved those sales in sufficient time for them to go ahead.

People said that the O'Brien deal was a transfer paperwork cock up by Broughton, Silvestre, Waggott. I don't believe so, I think authorisation couldn't be obtained from India in time to allow it to complete before the deadline. Looks like the same with McGuire.

People said that the owners had decided to change path from Mowbray which is why they let him go. I don't believe so, I think his contract ran out, they failed to do anything about it until even Mowbray got fed up with them and walked.

It is this silence and complete and utter indifference to the fortunes of their football club that saw Kean wreak havoc for years, that has seen a hollowing out of the club and decaying infrastructure, that saw Mowbray plod on the road to nowhere for 5 years, that sees Waggott sitting in an office he should be nowhere near and still on the gravy train after 6 years.

They are responsible.

Couldn’t agree more JH

[47er]

55 minutes ago, FE123 said:

I now believe that this “admin error” was intentional rather than a mistake. Sylvester, Waggott more than experienced enough dealing with international transfers. Never known to happen at any other football club but they expect us to believe they’ve made this mistake 3 times in 12 months. It’s nonsense and quite frankly an insult to the supporters that they expect us to believe it’s been done in error.

 

I believe that too. I also Believe Venkys wouldn't come at the price for signing MacGuire in the summer.

They probably baulked at paying the wages and fee for O'Brien as well and held that deal  up all it was too late.

I'd believe anything negative about these useless, spoilt idiots.

[garnersfags]

Ok, before this conspiracy theory becomes accepted fact, by enough of us quoting and accepting it, I do not believe that the Venkys or anyone else deliberately allowed these transfers to get down to the last seconds and pieces of paperwork before intentionally sabotaging them. 

There is no benefit to the club or Venky's in this approach, only severe reputational damage which lowers the financial value of the club. 

Behind the scenes misunderstandings, differences of opinion, and sheer incompetence, yes, but planned chaos and fraud, I really don't think so. 

There really is no benefit to anyone in this dysfunctional, immature, publicly self-destructive approach. 

They save this stuff for the behind the scenes incompetent, naive destruction of our great club. 

Edited February 5 by garnersfags

[Paul Mellelieu]

3 minutes ago, garnersfags said:

Ok, before this conspiracy theory becomes accepted fact, by enough of us quoting and accepting it, I do not believe that the Venkys or anyone else deliberately allowed these transfers to get down to the last seconds and pieces of paperwork before intentionally sabotaging them. 

There is no benefit to the club or Venky's in this approach, only severe reputational damage which lowers the financial value of the club. 

Behind the scenes misunderstandings, differences of opinion, and sheer incompetence, yes, but planned chaos and fraud, I really don't think so. 

There really is no benefit to anyone in this dysfunctional, immature, publicly self-destructive approach. 

They save this stuff for the behind the scenes incompetent, naive destruction of our great club. 

Exactly.

[RoversClitheroe]

5 minutes ago, garnersfags said:

There is no benefit to the club or Venky's in this approach, only severe reputational damage which lowers the financial value of the club. 

There is though? 

The benefit being it looks like Venkys would bankroll a big signing - for it to unfortunately fall through due to an "admin" error.

[AllRoverAsia]

Oh dear, oh deary, deary me.

O'Brien - DD we failed to get the Brighton striker, the midfielder becomes an expensive gamble that probably won't work without the striker. Deal fails.

McGuire - everything done. Someone decided late that the loan fee is too much. Deal fails.

Admin errors .... my arse