v Southampton (a) - 16/12/23

[tomphil]

5 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Not a chance we go down. We get our arses handed to us on days like yesterday but we win plenty against ‘normal’ sides and no reason that won’t continue. 

It was a crap afternoon but as usual on forums a fair few lose all perspective after a defeat like that.
 

To be fair it isn't the defeat nor even the scoreline that prompt some deep debate it's the performance itself and the selection, tactics and in some cases attitude.

All legit questions that can't be swept away just because it's Southampton away and we'd have been all over Mowbray after something like that.

There has to be a plan B to get any kind of result against the better sides but there doesn't ever seem to be one. Sadly i'm pretty confident had we gone there almost full strength we'd still be seeing something similar and asking the same questions i just wish we were still in an era where managers parked the bus in games like that.

[Mattyblue]

No problem with any of that, he’s not infallible by any means. If he was he wouldn’t he managing in this madhouse.

I was responding to the posters saying we need a new manager yesterday afternoon - i.e the ones that have lost all perspective.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Mattyblue

[SuperBrfc]

Certain Championship games now being written off is awful to see. Once again, this goes back to the morons at the top who couldn't care less about what is happening. Why bother about promotion when we can just develop players? We'll 'lease' players and play the Academy players, that'll save us some money, right, Mrs Desai? It's easier to use FFP and parachute payments as shields when you don't give a shit. Arrogant cowards, the lot of them, from the Board up.

The message is simple. If it's too costly for you, Balaji, you know what you and the rest of your family can go and do. The way the Indian Government is moving, we might not be too far away from getting what many of us wish for.

Ian Darke (commentator) had it right about us yesterday. He said Rovers have shown a lack of ambition and an inferiority complex from minute one of this game.

'Lack of ambition' and 'inferiority complex'.

I think those two descriptions don't just sum up yesterday, but the entire 13 year operation.

Very disheartening to see us like that yesterday, not getting anywhere near Championship opposition, and it just having to be accepted.

[philipl]

Not Callum's best day.

We had a gilt chance to take the lead after Bazoulis spilled Szmodic's free kick and sadly for all concerned it was Brittain onto it on the 6 yard box with the keeper rapidly closing him down. He didn't see Sigurdsson free as a bird inside him and onside so poked it unconvincingly at the keeper. The rest was unneccessary yellow, idiot yellow...

One weird positive, Harry Leonard looking good at right back late on.

Sadly another Moran off day and Szmodics running into cul-de-sacs. If we had just 5 injuries instead of 8, Andy Moran wouldn't have started and it is worrying that Markanday isn't convincing enough to get a chance in current circumstances even off the bench. 

And after defending 8 corners well, how does the 9th reach a Southampton player stood in front of Leo in the 6 yard box at knee height on the stroke of half time?? Generally Leo had a good game.

Southampton were ruthless as the clock ticked to 100 - i was expecting 3 or 4 minutes added on after only one at the end of the first half.

Which brings us to the ref. Not Sheffield Wednesday bad but VAR would have given Southampton the first half penalty for the shirt pull. The benefit given Southampton in the second half was pathetic.

 

[Mattyblue]

What I would say is the relegated sides this season are a step up from the usual rabble that come down.

Squads chock full of quality players as to be expected from long established PL clubs (less so Leeds but still an enormous wage bill). Luton, that lot and Sheff U will be more back to normal next summer.

Doesn’t excuse anything but they are bloody tough opposition for our stretched squad.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Mattyblue

[Sweaty Gussets]

1 hour ago, Blue blood said:

Disagree. I've said it before but if Hedges and Gally are the answer, it's a terrible question. Hyam is a huge loss but then having so few seasoned pros at the back is always going to make every absence worse. JRC huge loss too but as he is so injury prone it's not that surprising. 

The point was the team is weaker with those players missing.

Gally is better than anyone else we've tried up front this season, and Hedges is better than anyone else we've tried at RW. 

[Sweaty Gussets]

19 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

What I would say is the relegated sides this season are a step up from the usual rabble that come down.

Squads chock full of quality players as to be expected from long established PL clubs (less so Leeds but still an enormous wage bill). Luton, that lot and Sheff U will be more back to normal next summer.

Doesn’t excuse anything but they are bloody tough opposition for our stretched squad.

Watford are coming to a bit and starting to get the results their players should be getting. Saturday will be another tough afternoon where they will have one or two attacking players that could cause us problems that the non-parachute clubs don't have.

And then there's Hull soon after that who have been able to spend money and bring in the likes of Connolly. 

It's weird how the people who constantly moan about how shit things are at the club, are the same people who have wildly unrealistic expectations about how the team should be performing. Cognitive dissonance. 

[Crimpshrine]

56 minutes ago, SuperBrfc said:

Certain Championship games now being written off is awful to see. Once again, this goes back to the morons at the top who couldn't care less about what is happening. Why bother about promotion when we can just develop players? We'll 'lease' players and play the Academy players, that'll save us some money, right, Mrs Desai? It's easier to use FFP and parachute payments as shields when you don't give a shit. Arrogant cowards, the lot of them, from the Board up.

The message is simple. If it's too costly for you, Balaji, you know what you and the rest of your family can go and do. The way the Indian Government is moving, we might not be too far away from getting what many of us wish for.

Ian Darke (commentator) had it right about us yesterday. He said Rovers have shown a lack of ambition and an inferiority complex from minute one of this game.

'Lack of ambition' and 'inferiority complex'.

I think those two descriptions don't just sum up yesterday, but the entire 13 year operation.

Very disheartening to see us like that yesterday, not getting anywhere near Championship opposition, and it just having to be accepted.

'Lack of ambition' is Rovers in a nutshell. The CEO preaches it.

Only one answer and we all know what that is. New owners

[ben_the_beast]

Thought we were very poor yesterday. Where the instructions were to keep things tight we seemed to be confused as to when to press Southampton. We simply gave them way to much respect. 

That being said, after the first 15 minutes Southampton were creating very little of note. Only for us to give a very soft goal away on the stroke of half time.

Second half and the ref began woefully. He'd been giving Southampton free kicks for sweet fuck all throughout the first half and then waved play on for some of the clearest fouls you'll ever see against us. One of them being an incident which was far worse than what Brittain was booked for in the 1st half. It clearly wound him up, but there's no excuses for leathering the ball away. Brainless. It's frustrating on so many levels. You pay money to go and see the game ruined by a Brainless player, an incompetent Ref and stupid rules. In no way am I saying he shouldn't been shown a second yellow, but it was one of the most sterile games I've seen in a long, long time and a player still ended up seeing red. The rule makers and refs in general really are making football a bore. 

All in all we were poor before and after the red card. Moran was a passenger again. Poor on the ball and poor defensively. Brittain looked lost higher up the pitch and every other player was below par. 

The frustration is that we tend to play in patches. We may well have come back into the game, but Brittain ruined that for us. 

On Southampton they don't look like promotion contenders for me. For all their tippy- tap football, it took a poorly defended corner to break us open before having it easy against 10 tired men. 

Only positive is Travis looked as though he was chomping at the bit when he came on. Think we'll need his energy over the congested upcoming fixtures. He gets pelters sometimes, but when he's fresh, he's a good player.

[booth]

13 hours ago, tomphil said:

If you can't see the flaws in the lack of direction and action in altering things at times when it's clearly needed that's on you.

And him.

We know the issues nly to well and nobody expects much but some of it is pretty basic stuff.  Some fans need to accept that on matchday the gaffer on the sidelines owns responsibility for tactics and substitutions and playing a defender as a wide forward and leaving forwards on the bench.

 

If you can't see that our real issues are off the pitch, then that's on you.

Which benched forward makes a difference in yesterdays match?

[booth]

12 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Obviously teams with parachute money will always be favourites, but such are the budget cuts, its depressing to see us uncompetitive against them to the point where we almost write the games off.

When the CEO writes us off before the season starts, expect that to filter down. This goes back to the end of last season when coaches and players knew what was going on before we did.

[rigger]

4 minutes ago, booth said:

If you can't see that our real issues are off the pitch, then that's on you.

Which benched forward makes a difference in yesterdays match?

What's happening on the pitch is a real issue to me.

[booth]

10 minutes ago, rigger said:

What's happening on the pitch is a real issue to me.

"first and foremost, to stay in the league and develop players.” CEO, Blackburn Rovers

I'm more concerned with that, short and long term.

[rigger]

4 minutes ago, booth said:

"first and foremost, to stay in the league and develop players.” CEO, Blackburn Rovers

I'm more concerned with that, short and long term.

At the age of 64 I am more concerned about what is happening on the pitch, as that is what I am paying for.

[islander200]

After 22 games last season we were sat third in the league on 36 points.So we are only 5 points off what we had at this stage last season.

Considering the injury issues we have had, the failure to bring in any experience in the summer ,losing the experience of Dack and Ayala from the squad and Brererton and Kaminski in my eyes JDT is doing a fine job.

Days like yesterday will happen , hopefully we will see a reaction next Saturday in another tough game v Watford.

Absolutely no chance we get dragged into the relegation mix imo, and with the return of some of injured players and hopefully a bit of help in the transfer market in January then 6th is still obtainable.If we finish anywhere from 10th upwards then JDT can hold his head high in my opinion, considering every team around us was given money to strengthen in the summer.

[roversfan99]

We have been somewhat unfortunate with injuries of course, perhaps somewhat par for the course having to flog the same players repeatedly, not just hard luck.

Injury wise for the near future, we dont actually have that many out if no more fall foul of injury. Rankin Costello is a big loss, Hedges, Gallagher and Dolan are all average Championship players who fall short when it comes to being relied upon to push us into the players. So thats only 4 yet you look at the squad we had yesterday, its miles short. This is the third season in which a manager has done well working with a squad that is clearly not big or strong enough. At best when a summer comes around, we replace outgoings 1 for 1 and retain the same squad. Kids are expected to play regularly or at least be part of the squad even if they arent ready. Vale last season, Leonard is expected to play regularly this, we didnt sign another left back as to not "block Battys pathway" even though hes clearly not seen as ready, the list goes on. 

Tomasson shouldnt be given a free pass and he does at times make strange decisions. But he is obviously doing a good job with both hands tied behind his back 

[Mattyblue]

21 minutes ago, rigger said:

At the age of 64 I am more concerned about what is happening on the pitch, as that is what I am paying for.

They comment of Swag’s obviously directly impacts what you see on the pitch.

[rigger]

1 minute ago, Mattyblue said:

They comment of Swag’s obviously directly impacts what you see on the pitch.

I can only tell you what I think effects me most. If you think differently, so be it.

[Mattyblue]

What you see on the pitch impacts you the most, I know you just said and guess what that’s the same for every fan.

So maybe the club having a budget and a direction from the board that is set at just staying out of the third division may impact the product on the pitch.

[SuperBrfc]

11 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

They comment of Swag’s obviously directly impacts what you see on the pitch.

Along with comments from Broughton such as:

1. "For Blackburn Rovers to be back in the Premier League we have to overachieve".

2. ""So, I think we need to have a definition of what winning looks like for Blackburn Rovers, and for me that's very clear. Clearly, it's just improving our performance every single day and in every single month and every single year".

Add to that, the owners failing to spend from a relative position of strength two consecutive January's running, what message does all of that send to everybody at the club?

There is absolutely no pressure or expectation on any of them. The only guy who is on our (the fans) wavelength, mentality wise, is JDT. 

Apparently it was just shite and conspiracy on a forum that none of the hierarchy are arsed about promotion, but when the CEO himself is saying the aim is just to stay in this Division and develop players...it shows the so called moaners have every right to call this out.

[Mattyblue]

To be fair to Broughton he has also repeatedly said ‘we want to be an established and sustainable Premier League club’, obviously that’s just platitudes with this set up, but at least he pretends that BRFC is like every other pro football club that exists to try and get to the highest level they can - Swag doesn’t even bother doing that.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Mattyblue

[Uddersfelt Blue]

Let’s not beat ourselves up over a defeat to a team with several ex-Premier League players. Before the stupidity of the sending off we had defended pretty well and could have been level. After that, well there was only going to be one result. 

IMO we should be playing Travis in games like this, he gets stuck in and unsettles the opposition. Unfortunately Moran, as talented as he is, is too lightweight and easily dispossessed. A three in midfield of Travis, Tronstadt and Wharton (furthest forward) would give us some solidity. 
 

Whilst the likes of Gally, Hedges and Dolan are average Championship players they are being badly missed and if out long term they must be replaced in January, albeit with loans.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 17, 2023 by Uddersfelt Blue

[Wheelton Blue]

6 hours ago, Parsonblue said:

I think recent games have illustrated just how important Dolan is to the way we play.  At the time of his injury he was in terrific form and linked so well with Szmodics and Moran.  The three of them created chances with their quick interplay.  Also Dolan led the press in a way that Leonard isn't able to do because he is a different type of player.  In recent games both Moran and Szmodics seem to be dropping deeper and deeper and therefore have less impact on the game in terms of attack.  Again, it just illustrates how limited the options are for JDT - especially as two of the summer signings Ennis and Telalovic seems well short of the standard required at the moment.

That is true of Dolan to a degree, but IMO he's merely the best of a very bad bunch.

[aletheia]

Re my comment yesterday which was perhaps misleading:-

As to the notion that JDT has run his course and it’s time to look elsewhere. I see it. Get in a seasoned pro who will buy experience and toughen up the team.

I wasn't suggesting that we do that  at all -the subsequent para goes on to state how I think that would go -badly. Ie. SWAG would bring in somebody desperate (unless lied to about possible funds). JDT is working miracles in a dysfuntional set up.

I do think JDT could be a little more flexible at times. Eg. Trav, Garrett could have played; Hill to centre back.

[Mattyblue]

Don’t you think JDT would like to buy experienced and tough players?