England - Thomas Tuchel then…

[AllRoverAsia]

Fuck this.

[RTM08]

4 hours ago, Paul Mellelieu said:

My experience is the they find it a bit sad.  They have the Dutch to hate....

As for Tuckel, great appointment, but a sign of failure of the FA's stewardship of the game.

It always a feels a bit like when Preston try to big up the games with them as the biggest of deals when ultimately the vast majority are focused on the Burnley games more. 

I wasn't that attuned with the news and all that as I was quite young when Sven and Capello were appointed, was the media backlash like it has been the last couple of days? The right wing rags, radio shows and even Sky Sports seem to be posting nothing but different people complaining about it with differing degrees of vitriol. 

Honestly some of the stuff has seen has crossed the line into just nasty, ultimately whether you like him or not he's still the England manager. Seen people say they'd rather we won nothing with an English manager - it's pathetic. 

[Andy]

Yeah, the England > Germany thing seems a bit like the Scotland > England thing, or Preston > Rovers.
Means a lot more to one set of fans/people than the others.

I go to Berlin a couple of times a year with work and I really like Germany, the people and the culture.

The idea of animosity being passed down generations is fanciful at best.

[Norbert Rassragr]

7 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

How about they just get rid of it and don’t replace with friendlies either?

Ideal all round for the 99% of football fans who don’t give a toss about international football outside tournaments.

Then how do we test players, tactics and suchlike? There probably needs to be a low risk game to try things out.

[roverandout]

6 hours ago, rigger said:

Are we not already seeded ?

Yes but other nations use it

[rigger]

2 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Yes but other nations use it

So, for England they are no better than friendlies, except we can't pick who or when we play. 

[Upside Down]

5 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

I don’t know a single person that has an issue with Germany or Germans. And when you go there they love speaking to Brits. Culturally very similar people.

Long standing allies pre and post a couple of rather unfortunate incidents in the first half of the 20th century.

Britain was allied with Nazi Germany for a good time and wealthy aristocrats were funding them until they started to encroach on the Empire's territory.

Don't forget the royal family were all very supportive of Hitler. Fucking scum.

[Upside Down]

1 hour ago, Andy said:

Yeah, the England > Germany thing seems a bit like the Scotland > England thing, or Preston > Rovers.
Means a lot more to one set of fans/people than the others.

I go to Berlin a couple of times a year with work and I really like Germany, the people and the culture.

The idea of animosity being passed down generations is fanciful at best.

It's fucking childish. People need to grow the fuck up.

[Mattyblue]

Hmmm, appeasement was nothing to be proud of, but ‘allies’ is a pushing it just a tad.

[Mattyblue]

38 minutes ago, Norbert Rassragr said:

Then how do we test players, tactics and suchlike? There probably needs to be a low risk game to try things out.

Qualification games provide all the low risk matches England need, then a few warm ups before the tournament to top it up.

[M_B]

Let's see if he can better Southgate's tournament record. If he does, German or not( I personally don't care), he'll go down as a national (football) hero.

[simongarnerisgod]

32 minutes ago, Upside Down said:

Britain was allied with Nazi Germany for a good time and wealthy aristocrats were funding them until they started to encroach on the Empire's territory.

Don't forget the royal family were all very supportive of Hitler. Fucking scum.

you should research your history before spouting a load of b******s,the only nazi sympathiser,edward viii,abdicated and ***** off to france before the war,the rest of the family stayed in britain instead of fleeing to a safe haven,indeed mountbatten was in the navy and organised raids on dieppe and st nazaire

you really think hitler,if he conquered europe would let the british royal family keep their status🙂,he`d have been in buck house quicker than a gypsy can find scrap metal,don`t know what he`d have done to the royals,but i guarantee they would`nt be goosestepping down the mall with him,more than likely they`de be quietly disposed of

[London blue]

I feel we may have veered slightly off topic.

[Upside Down]

19 minutes ago, simongarnerisgod said:

you should research your history before spouting a load of b******s,the only nazi sympathiser,edward viii,abdicated and ***** off to france before the war,the rest of the family stayed in britain instead of fleeing to a safe haven,indeed mountbatten was in the navy and organised raids on dieppe and st nazaire

you really think hitler,if he conquered europe would let the british royal family keep their status🙂,he`d have been in buck house quicker than a gypsy can find scrap metal,don`t know what he`d have done to the royals,but i guarantee they would`nt be goosestepping down the mall with him,more than likely they`de be quietly disposed of

I have read the history. Maybe you should too, and try looking a bit further than the BBC.

The British aristocracy were pushing for Britain to side with ze Germans against Soviet Russia.

I'm also not sure why the government trying to find a peaceful solution is so reviled. Surely no war would have been better than the absolute horrors of WW2?

Anyway, we'll see if Tuchel will get gifted the sort of draws that the wet lettuce did. He'll probably get given a draw of Brasil, Argentina and Germany in the group stage, have a massive injury crisis and miss out on goal difference or something. Then people will be saying that Southgate is superior or some bollocks without taking anything into context.

[Eddie]

Not sure that's the most accurate representation of history. 

[rigger]

13 hours ago, London blue said:

I feel we may have veered slightly off topic.

I don't know if the Germans would get your sense of humour (or mine).

Edited October 18 by rigger

[riverholmes]

It understandably hurts pride to know that this major football nation can’t produce a decent coach or two. (Let alone a well functioning team) and needs to turn to a sporting rival. But I’d advise all to consider that the British game is literally being bought up by US investors, in particular, even to point of Women’s Championship sides and EFL. It’s a takeover occurring throughout the economy, but this is the real threat (not the nationalities but the values) to the national game as these billionaires and corporations are generally far removed from the fan.

Owners in English football - a list which might not be wholly updated; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_owners_of_English_football_clubs

Edited October 18 by riverholmes

[RevidgeBlue]

Not been able to access the site for a while. It's good to have it back.

Initially I was a bit disappointed with the Tuchel appointment as I really really wanted Pep and he was always at great pains not to rule himself out of the running so I thought there was a slight chance.

The more I think about the Tuchel appointment though the more excited I am by it. He's a great tactician which is what we've been lacking for the last 8-9 years. Someone to push us over the line in tight games.

He's also the exact opposite of the safe no risk appointments the FA have often made in the past so all credit to them in that respect for once.

I can't believe a lot of the anti German sentiment in many quarters and less predictably from the Daily Mail "A dark day for England etc". It's not 1945 for crying out loud!. Who cares what nationality the manager/coach is if he wins us a bloody tournament?

[RevidgeBlue]

20 hours ago, Upside Down said:

Anyway, we'll see if Tuchel will get gifted the sort of draws that the wet lettuce did. He'll probably get given a draw of Brasil, Argentina and Germany in the group stage, have a massive injury crisis and miss out on goal difference or something. Then people will be saying that Southgate is superior or some bollocks without taking anything into context.

Yup, we've already got the Southgate apologists out in force in the media like his mate Stuart Pearce saying that "the next step" on from Southgate is winning something etc.

[Mashed Potatoes]

1 hour ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Yup, we've already got the Southgate apologists out in force in the media like his mate Stuart Pearce saying that "the next step" on from Southgate is winning something etc.

There are no "Southgate apologists" for the simple reason that his record as England manager was so superior to his predecessors in the previous 50 years that there was nothing to apologise for.

[bluebruce]

On 17/10/2024 at 20:45, Upside Down said:

Britain was allied with Nazi Germany for a good time and wealthy aristocrats were funding them until they started to encroach on the Empire's territory.

Don't forget the royal family were all very supportive of Hitler. Fucking scum.

A little off topic, but Poland wasn't part of the British Empire. Alliance is a stretch too (Hitler wanted one but never got it), but perhaps you meant the policy of appeasement, which was more about avoiding a war and the sense that we had gone too far in punishing Germany in the Treaty of Versailles (probably true tbf) and that once they'd more or less regained their losses they'd stop. They were also seen as a buffer against the 'communists' of the Soviet Union, which was seen as a bigger threat, especially amongst the ruling upper classes. It was only the invasion of Poland, in cahoots with the Soviets, that proved once and for all how naive all of this was. I've studied the war at school, college and uni and I can't recall any meddling with the Empire's lands until war broke out. There may have been some little disputes I've forgotten?

I don't know how accurate it is to say 'all' the royal family were supportive of Hitler. It's well documented about Edward, but beyond that I'm not sure. Due to the rise of the Soviet Union and the red scare, along with Hitler holding back the worst parts of his nature and actually rejuvenating what had been a broken Germany, it's true that in many circles he was initially seen in a positive light. The antisemitism shit wasn't limited to Germany either.

Anyway none of it matters towards this appointment one jot. Tuchel wasn't even alive, and to think the rise of fascism and genocide is some inherently German thing is dangerously naive (and in fact falls into the same kind of thinking that the Nazis had). It can happen in any country if they aren't vigilant enough.

[Mattyblue]

To be fair UD rowed back from Britain being ‘allies’ of Germany in his subsequent post.

Edited October 19 by Mattyblue

[chaddyrovers]

On 16/10/2024 at 12:22, MarkBRFC71 said:

Fair enough, it wouldn't have surprised me if it was knee-jerk but they seemed to have planned it a while ago after all.

Ok thanks. Looking back you can see why Carsley made those comments and the FA did it work behind the scenes and none of it went public which I think was a good thing. 

On 16/10/2024 at 12:22, MarkBRFC71 said:

I agree that I would choose an Englishman IF (and it's a big if) they were on an equal footing to a foreign candidate, but it would be foolish to stand by that and appoint a piss-poor candidate (eg Lampard) just because they are English. 

This is where we have agree to disagree. I believe we should have employed an Englishman and Sam Allardyce and Harry Redknapp agreed with my opinion. I respected your opinion and I hope that Tuchel is successful for the England football team and supporters and he will have my backing. If you were looking at Non-Englishman options then Tuchel is about 3rd or 4th on the list after Pep Guardiola, Carlo Ancelotti, Brendan Rodgers and then Thomas Tuchel. 

I am also interested into seeing what Tuchel's coaching staff is. Tuchel's number 2 Anthony Barry is highly regarded in the football world and it will interesting to see what influence he has. 

[RevidgeBlue]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Ok thanks. Looking back you can see why Carsley made those comments and the FA did it work behind the scenes and none of it went public which I think was a good thing. 

This is where we have agree to disagree. I believe we should have employed an Englishman and Sam Allardyce and Harry Redknapp agreed with my opinion. I respected your opinion and I hope that Tuchel is successful for the England football team and supporters and he will have my backing. If you were looking at Non-Englishman options then Tuchel is about 3rd or 4th on the list after Pep Guardiola, Carlo Ancelotti, Brendan Rodgers and then Thomas Tuchel. 

I am also interested into seeing what Tuchel's coaching staff is. Tuchel's number 2 Anthony Barry is highly regarded in the football world and it will interesting to see what influence he has. 

Brendan Rogers?

Blimey.

I'd Say Guardiola and Klopp were the two ideal candidates, after that Tuchel is as good as we could get imo. Look at the effect he had on Chelsea after inheriting a mess off Frank Lampard.

[RevidgeBlue]

18 hours ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

There are no "Southgate apologists" for the simple reason that his record as England manager was so superior to his predecessors in the previous 50 years that there was nothing to apologise for.

On this occasion I'm not going to bite. Southgate's been done to death and there's no point crying over spilt milk.