[Archived] Will You Show The Fla A Yellow Card?

[Glenn]

Amanda. I'm a big supporter of what you are trying to do and very impressed with how you are going about it.

However, so you don't upset some of the locals could you keep your updates (which, unlike some around here, I'm very interested in reading) to this thread (because it then saves somebody the job of merging them together).

Going back to the topic in hand (rather than bitchin' about wether we care) Rovers are in a somewhat unique position to trial this idea because.

a. We have more seats than fans.

b. We have a stand the is due development

c. We've had a very noticable loss of atmosphere

d. We need an initiative to bring fans back to the ground.

e. Our catchment area includes a greater proportion of working class to prawn sandwich than many.

Turning part of the Riverside (E04, where we don't have ST holders and do the £15 tickets that nobody knows about) into a safe standing area would be fantastic and hopefully address some of the attendance and atmosphere problem.

Even occasional standing seems to be getting less acceptable. I was somewhat amazed that just before half time at Boro away I received a tap on the shoulder asking me to politely but firmly sit down. The problem was I had stood up three times, not to make some silly point about standing, or to join in some daft "stand up if you .... " song,. Nope I had stood up for no more than 4 seconds at a time, to berate the ref ! Now being someone that doesn't like to inpinge on others enjoyment of the game I stayed firmly rooted to my seat fro the second half. But it did make me realise just WHY the amosphere at games is dying !

[roversWASmylife]

Just to add a point.

I think everyone will agree with me on this one that how much better the atmosphere was when we played Burnley at home when everyone in the Blackburn End was standing.

[seahawkdad]

I think standing is essential for great match atmosphere. What it does is to concentrate the least self-restrained, rabid supporters in one spot, thus letting them really get into it and to easily coordinate chants and songs. All attending benefit from that.

It also pulls them away from other parts of the crowd, so those who want a more restrained experience (kids and all) can more likely get that.

We have two designated standing areas for DC United, coordinated between supporters groups and the club. These groups even sell the tickets for their sections. It results in almost Euro-like fan experience, which is often difficult to come by over here. I choose to sit on the opposite side, known to the standees as the quiet side. If they couldn't stand, they'd be more subdued and probably dispersed amongst the crowd...less effect, less fun for all.

As to the safety/risk argument, I fail to see the danger. I think it's been well said earlier in the thread...you can't get crowd surge when each row of standees is separated by a row of seat backs. At national team matches, whole sections are designated as standing, filled by a supporters group, Sams Army. I've stood with the Army twice. It was a great experience and taught me to really appreciate half time And I've never had anyone surge into me from behind, nor have I surged forward...can't be done. At the DC United league semi last season, the whole 24,000 fans were standing from about half-way through the second half, through a 1/2 hour of overtime and on through penalties to decide the match. You can imagine the atmosphere (my legs ached for the next two days)...no injuries. I have never had such a great sports experience. Standing was a major part of that. How can anyone sit for something like that? I think the injury risk claim is just bogus.

The only problem I've experienced is when some clown decides to try to stand the whole match in the middle of a seating section. That's where the club has to get insistent about plunking butts back down in seats. But it's easier to do that if one can point to a standing section where that behavior is expected and suggest buying a ticket for that area at the next match.

Good luck with the fight.

Edited March 12, 2005 by seahawkdad

[cletus]

Going back to the topic in hand (rather than bitchin' about wether we care) Rovers are in a somewhat unique position to trial this idea because.

a. We have more seats than fans.

b. We have a stand the is due development

c. We've had a very noticable loss of atmosphere

d. We need an initiative to bring fans back to the ground.

e. Our catchment area includes a greater proportion of working class to prawn sandwich than many

.....Just out of interest,

Has anybody actually approached the club about this??

I`d be all for a standing section.

[GiddyGoat]

I can give you tons of examples of serious injuries/deaths with open area standing. Can anyone give me one with standing in front of seats?

Ellis Park Jo-burgh 2001 43 killed and hundreds injured. Kaizer Chiefs v Orlando Pirates

When people were knocked off their chairs, others dropped on top of them or stomped over their bodies in a desperate attempt to save themselves. I’ll never forget this one guy pinned to the floor below me, crying out for me to pull him up to safety as I was being shoved around like a rag doll. Bloodcurdling screams came out of his mouth as he begged, “Help me! Help me!” Even then I was sure he was doomed. I didn’t have the strength to fight against the fury of human bodies. I couldn’t do anything. I knew if I bent over I’d be overrun by the stampede of frightened people.

From the looks of it, 2 things were different. First, it looks as if people were standing on the chairs and second, it looks as if they were removable folding chairs, which is far different from standing in front of a chair bolted into the concrete.

As far as I remember the seating in Ellis Park is standard stadium seating. If there where a major stampede in a crowd the fact that there is a row of seats between you and the person in front and behind is irellevant to your chances of survival.

This disaster was caused by a stampede and the subsiquent panic. Similar to Hillsborough the police made poor decisions and let a large crowd in to the staduim in one go, the stadium was already full and there was a stampede for the exits. Some where trampled to death between the seats, some where crushed to death in the gangways.

My opinion, for what it is worth, is that well designed side filled terracing is as safe as anything else. Taylors recommendations where jumped upon by a government who had an overt anti-football agenda. Anyway I agree that this has been done to death so I'll shut up about it.

[Gav]

so I'll shut up about it.

Please do........

[colin]

Lord Taylor's Report

Scroll down to The Taylor Report.

Seating wasn't introduced as a one-off issue, it was a part of a far wider-ranging paradigm surrounding football.

Ranging from the way that the police & clubs treated fans like scum, to the likelihood of you finishing the game stood in a puddle of urine because 5,000 people couldn't get to a three-man urinal at half time, to .....................Hillsborough.

I very much doubt that seating/standing section will be stripped out of progress made since The Taylor Report, and reversed.

[mhead]

And badger-baiting brought back.

[CAPT KAYOS]

Going back to the topic in hand (rather than bitchin' about wether we care) Rovers are in a somewhat unique position to trial this idea because.

a. We have more seats than fans.

b. We have a stand the is due development

c. We've had a very noticable loss of atmosphere

d. We need an initiative to bring fans back to the ground.

e. Our catchment area includes a greater proportion of working class to prawn sandwich than many

.....Just out of interest,

Has anybody actually approached the club about this??

I`d be all for a standing section.

They certainly have Cletus - try StuWilky - also in the process myself of sending another mail (keep forgetting).

Just for information - for those signed up to the campaign you tend to be advised of what is going on , discussions etc - I have just received a copy of the report re the last meeting with the Football Licensing Authority which makes interesting reading and available via the site - very noticeable is the lack of back up factsand information from the FLA etc and reluctance that helps sustains their argument against the proposals set by SUSD - in addition there would appear to be the fear factor from the clubs to stick their necks out even though some would appear to back the proposals.

All I say to people is what would you rather have - the morgue like yesterday and other games or the full thunder of the derby games against our neighbours down the M65?

[Amanda]

www.standupsitdown.co.uk

info@standupsitdown.co.uk

At their home game against Manchester City yesterday, a group of Tottenham Hotspur supporters organised an extremely successful “Show the FLA the Yellow Card” protest in an area of the ground where standing and vocal support go hand in hand. The protest emphasised the right of the supporter to choose whether to sit or stand in pre-designated standing areas areas. THFC respected the protesters’ freedom of speech and enabled them to distribute and hold up the yellow cards. The Manchester City supporters’ group, Atmosphere Action Group, lent its support to the Spurs protesters.

The action consisted of supporters raising yellow cards just prior to kick off and it was very well observed. Regrettably, demand for yellow cards in the South Stand outstripped supply – many other people clearly wanted to show their support for the campaign. The protest organiser, Lynn Hancock, was interviewed for BBC Radio London, which was aired on the Danny Kelly programme on the afternoon of Sunday 20th March.

We would now like to arrange similar peaceful protests at clubs of all divisions across the UK but to do this we need YOUR help, both physical and financial! The season is fast drawing to a close so we need to act quickly to take full advantage of the growing interest in Stand Up Sit Down.

If you would like to be involved in an unprecedented action, where club loyalties are put to one side and supporters are, for once, united in their common aims, please get in touch with us as soon as possible.

· This is NOT a protest against your club. It is a protest against the Football Licensing Authority the people responsible for ensuring local authorities and clubs do all they can to ensure supporters sit, regardless of their personal preference.

· We will provide you with a template of a yellow card. You will have to arrange to get this printed locally at your own expense. If supporters of neighbouring clubs are willing to arrange a protest then perhaps the cost could be shared between the two groups. Again, we will put supporters in touch with each other.

· We suggest the distribution of cards is concentrated in the area of your ground where supporters tend to persistently stand – and ordinarily where your most vocal supporters are!

· You will have to get enough people to distribute the cards to supporters. We will put like minded supporters of the same club in touch with each other and if we can arrange a protest so both home and away support can simultaneously hold up their yellow cards, then so much the better.

· Once we have your guaranteed support, we will arrange press releases to national newspapers and provide you with a template to contact local newspapers.

· We will provide you with a letter for you to send to your club to explain what you are doing and why.

· Ideally, this would happen on the same day. Once we have your responses, we can arrange a date whereby the fixtures are simultaneous but not a problem is this is not practical.

·

In the meantime, we will carry on our work behind the scenes lobbying those with the influence to force change, but just think how great our much greater OUR influence could be, if we truly united over this issue so important to so many of us.

Please contact info@standupsitdown.co.uk

[CAPT KAYOS]

TO STAND OR NOT?

Better late than never but here is an excellent Article for thus pro or anti standing..

Rememebr its about having areas of choice which can be controlled and not total standing.

Interesting that again Rovers are absent with their own comments, and choose to sit on the fence.

[Florida Rover]

Just read the article below from soccernet regarding changes to football stadiums and conditions and their changes over the last ten years.Looks like there is no going back and to be honest deep down no one is surprised

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/feature?id=337736&cc=5901

Florida Rover

[skiporovers]

Well wots the point in taking away seats!! During big games with atmosphere people stand anyway, even wit adequete seats provided..........Anyone go to celtic away a couple of years ago???? I did and never once sat on the seat or against Burnley both home and away last season.....there were seats but no sittin down..........so wots the point in removin seats wen those games only come around once a year.......id love to see the people whod pay £20 to stand and watch us play fulham!! What an atmosphere the terraces will produce wen 36 away fans drop by!! You need a seat to collapse of boredom into!

Edited August 2, 2005 by skiporovers

[ihtd]

I am up for anything that brings back the atmosphere to Ewood, if it means standing, i would not object to it. Its great to be at a match were you leave it with hardly any voice left. But then again after every Blackburn match, i have no voice left from shouting at the ref or players.

[Ozz]

Away Day Blues for the Reds...

The last quote from Varney sounds interesting...

[neekoy]

Good post Bob

I know this isn't exactly related to standing but one for our crazy litigist (sp?) society and therefore relating to the club finances.

I am in commercial property, and we had a bloke while messaging on his mobile phone, walk to the right hand side of an automatic exit, with massive double glass doors, emergency exit signage above and a mat which leads from the lift to the doorway and into a nine foot high 5 foot wide glass panel (high rise design) with glass frosting design.

Idiot you think?

We have just been named as a party in the action for compensation of $500,000.

Now taking this into this threads theme, here is our club struggling to get enough funds to get a decent transfer and all of a sudden we are being sued for a million pound because someone was "pushed over" while standing. I've never been pushed over while sitting